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Offline middlenamewayne

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Who's More PUNK - Stooges or Marx Bros?
« on: October 17, 2009, 03:18:02 AM »
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  • This just kinda came out of me a little while back. I hope this amuses somebody out there.
    Or leads to some heavy philosophical discussions or something:

            Who's More Punk - The 3 Stooges or the Marx Bros?

    Here's a few facts, taken largely from common knowledge but also
    peppered with bits of info found on the Web or in various reference
    materials. I'll present the evidence, and you can take it upon
    yourselves to review it and decide - Who's more "punk", the
    Marx Brothers or the Three Stooges:

    1)Iggy Pop's first successful band, who are considered by many to be
    the godfathers of punk rock, were named The Stooges. Band member Ron
    Asheton
    regularly visited Larry Fine in the retirement home where the
    "middle Stooge" lived out his last days following a disabling
    stroke. Also, the band only made a trio of albums in their lifetime,
    meaning that hardcore fans must refer to their record collection as
    containing "three Stooges LPs". Finally, novelty label Rhino
    Records once issued a version of the Ig's signature anthem "I Wanna
    Be Your Dog" released under the group name The Seven Stooges, with
    Pop and his band's original recording supplemented with slapstick noises
    and imitation Stooge voices.

    2)Current LA band Los Villains was recently described in the press as
    "a squadron of Irish-Italian-Mexican-American punk rock Marx
    Brothers
    ."

    3)Jonathan Richman's seminal early 1970s band the Modern Lovers were
    not punk rockers per se but are considered to be among punk's most
    important influences. The waif-ish Richman looks like, and often acts
    like, a ringer for Harpo Marx.*

    4)The Ramones' haircuts resembled Moe Howard's bowl job in front,
    paired with youthful revolt's length in back. Journalists sometimes
    referred to the band as a pack of "Neanderthals" early on, bringing
    to mind the anthropologists in Hollywood Party and elsewhere who described
    Curly Howard as an evolutionary throwback. And finally, the art/entertainment
    periodical MetroActive says, in discussing the Ramones, "The Three
    Stooges
    come to mind probably because, like the Stooges, the Ramones
    were all about the grind of showbiz."

    5)The Damned, who were the first British punk band to release an album
    and tour the USA, are fans of classic comedy. They issued a Christmas
    single at the height of their popularity entitled "There Ain't No
    Sanity Claus" - a direct Marxist reference from the brothers'
    highly-regarded motion picture A Night At the Opera.

    6)The Dickies, who were the first (and almost only) 1970s US punk band
    signed to a major label, scored a hit with "The Tra La La Song" aka
    the theme from Saturday morning kiddie show The Banana Splits. The
    Splits in turn were something of a mishmash of the the Monkees, the Marxes,
    and the Stooges (albeit clothed in humongous animal costumes).

    7)Respected UK music tabloid NME says this of Green Day, the band who
    elevated punk from a cult thing to a mass audience mega-moneymaking
    proposition: "They're like a punk-rock Marx Brothers, goofing together and
    with the audience, dribbling an infectious, agreeable mischief."

    8)Malcolm McLaren, the Svengali manager of the Sex Pistols, later
    performed as a solo act and scored a major UK dance club hit with
    "Bickie-Bye", better known as the Howard, Fine and Howard classic
    "The Alphabet Song" ("Bee, Ay, Bay! Bee, Ee, Bee! Bee, I...") which
    debuted in the 1938 Stooge short Violent Is the Word For Curly.

    [2012 CORRECTION: The above paragraph is in error - it was Oingo Boingo's Danny Elfman who performed an updated rendition of this Stooges tune in the cult film "The Forbidden Zone". McLaren scored his big hit with the oldie "Buffalo Gals".I have absolutely no idea how I had this mixed up for so many years!]

    9)The bizarre on-stage, way-off-Broadway concoction WolfTales,
    described on its web page as an "audience participation rock and roll
    musical" features a porcine punk rock trio whose members go by the
    names Moe Pig, Larry Pig, and Curly Pig.

    10)At a recent show headlined by the Offspring, old guard punks the
    Vandals drew the following review: "...the Vandals - they're old, too,
    like, 30 or something - [and they] came across like the punk Marx
    Brothers
    ."

    11)The publisher of the legendary punk magazine Punk Magazine
    described his editorial vision thusly: "I thought the magazine should
    be for other f***-ups like us.  Kids who grew up believing only in the
    Three Stooges."

    12)A press release regarding the 2004 edition of the hard-rocking
    multi-band Warped Tour says of the act El Nada that at the tour's
    Chicago stop, a pair of band members "took the lead to handle their
    biz [...] two by two, trying to get through the doorway of production at
    the same time, recreating a scene reminiscent of something out of the
    Three Stooges."

    13)UK paper the Guardian calls the Marxes' film Monkey Business
    "full of aimless chaos - the sense of pointless rebellion throughout
    is as modern and anarchic as, say, punk rock."

    14)Jason Willis of current punk band the Knockout Pills from Tuscon
    AZ, recently was quoted as saying "Punk Rock is the best thing that
    ever came along for me. It kisses my furrowed brow as a I drop off to
    sleep and it holds my hand when I cross the street. It's everything
    from the Fluxus art movement to the Three Stooges, you know?"

    15)The Alice Cooper Group began their career dressing in drag like
    proto-punks the New York Dolls and were a major influence on the Sex
    Pistols. In the liner notes of the anthology box set The Life &
    Crimes of Alice Cooper
    , A.C. annotates the band's early number
    "Nobody Likes Me" with the proud declaration that "Groucho Marx
    loved this song!"


    Feel free to follow up with further facts, figures, and fancies!

      - mnw
    « Last Edit: January 31, 2012, 12:24:16 AM by middlenamewayne »

    Offline metaldams

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    Re: Who's More PUNK - Stooges or Marx Bros?
    « Reply #1 on: October 17, 2009, 09:18:18 AM »
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  • I have the Alice box set, but I always wondered where Groucho would've even heard the song.  I wasn't aware "Nobody Likes Me" had a general release during his lifetime.  That said, the song is very Marx Brothers like and would easily fit in their Paramount films.

    I've never been much a punk guy.  More classic metal and classic rock, but I know for a fact The Three Stooges inspired KISS's "Calling Dr. Love."  Gene Simmons was quoted as saying "The calling Dr. Howard, Dr. Fine, Dr. Howard" bit inspired the song.

    Offline metaldams

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    Re: Who's More PUNK - Stooges or Marx Bros?
    « Reply #2 on: October 17, 2009, 09:21:32 AM »
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  • Oh, and Queen's 1976 classic A NIGHT AT THE OPERA was followed up but their other 1976 album - A DAY AT THE RACES.  Ironically, both the albums and films with said titles take the same artistic quality path - classic, then good, but not quite the quality of its predecessor.

    Offline FineBari3

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    Re: Who's More PUNK - Stooges or Marx Bros?
    « Reply #3 on: October 17, 2009, 09:32:29 AM »
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  • Well done!  You should submit that to the Three Stooges Journal!   [thumbsup]

    (Hey Mr. Finegan! Did you see #8 on this guy's list...did you know about that?)

    Oh, it's too early to philosophise!   [sleepy1]

    I will say that I have always associated the Marx Brothers with anarchy, and anarchy with Punk.

    The Three Stooges were always trying to be a productive part of society in their films, even if they did do a bad job at it. The Marxes never seemed to care that much about anything running smoothly, and even led a country into a chaotic state. 

    Now, Marx-ism and the Three Stooges is another thing all together!
    Mar-Jean Zamperini
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    Re: Who's More PUNK - Stooges or Marx Bros?
    « Reply #4 on: October 17, 2009, 05:56:05 PM »
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  • The Three Stooges were always trying to be a productive part of society in their films, even if they did do a bad job at it.

    With the possible exception of Moe Hailstone and his gang, but those were meant to be biting satire.

    Offline middlenamewayne

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    Re: Who's More PUNK - Stooges or Marx Bros?
    « Reply #5 on: October 17, 2009, 06:44:11 PM »
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  • I have the Alice box set, but I always wondered where Groucho would've even heard the song.  I wasn't aware "Nobody Likes Me" had a general release during his lifetime. 

    I just read elsewhere the other day that Julius and Vincent were good pals, so Cap'n. Spaulding wouldn't have had to hear the song on the radio. Maybe AC had an 8-track deck in his golf cart?

    Here's the lyrics so others may judge their Marx-men-ship:

    NOBODY LIKES ME

    Nobody likes me
    It's all my fault
    Nobody likes me
    Nobody likes me

    Oh yes we all like you!
    We like you a lot!
    Yes we all like you!
    Yes we all like you!


    I never get a letter.
    We have no time
    Never ever get a call from you
    We have no dime

    Oh yes you do
    Oh no we don't (x 3)
    Yes! No! Yes! No! (etc.)

    Never call, never write
    Yes we do always try
    Make me cry all the night
    Sorry we made you cry
    Make me mad, Make me sad
    Tell me true, what can I do?

    Way too late can't make up
    All the hate has built up
    Ha ha ha ha aaah

    Alright, we all hate you
    We hate you a lot
    We hate all your family
    We hate your dog Spot

    Even Spot?
    Yes!

    (OTOH: Alice's schmaltzy "Next, Next" in Mae West's 1978 "Sextette" -- penned by Van "Do The Hustle!" McCoy -- is the sort of torch song that makes you wish they'd torched the whole movie set!)

    I've never been much a punk guy.  More classic metal and classic rock, but I know for a fact The Three Stooges inspired KISS's "Calling Dr. Love."  Gene Simmons was quoted as saying "The calling Dr. Howard, Dr. Fine, Dr. Howard" bit inspired the song.

    Of that I was not aware! Gosh!

      - mnw

    Offline metaldams

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    Re: Who's More PUNK - Stooges or Marx Bros?
    « Reply #6 on: October 17, 2009, 08:02:48 PM »
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  • I will say that I have always associated the Marx Brothers with anarchy, and anarchy with Punk.

    At Paramount, for sure, but by the time they got to MGM, the Marx Brothers were usually trying to play matchmaker to the romantic couples.  I always hated the part in A NIGHT AT THE OPERA where Groucho has a "prescription" for the leading lady (a love letter from her lover). 

    Then again, Harpo was a book burning punk at Paramount, no doubt.

    Offline metaldams

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    Re: Who's More PUNK - Stooges or Marx Bros?
    « Reply #7 on: October 17, 2009, 08:07:56 PM »
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  • I just read elsewhere the other day that Julius and Vincent were good pals, so Cap'n. Spaulding wouldn't have had to hear the song on the radio. Maybe AC had an 8-track deck in his golf cart?

    Here's the lyrics so others may judge their Marx-men-ship:

    NOBODY LIKES ME

    Nobody likes me
    It's all my fault
    Nobody likes me
    Nobody likes me

    Oh yes we all like you!
    We like you a lot!
    Yes we all like you!
    Yes we all like you!


    I never get a letter.
    We have no time
    Never ever get a call from you
    We have no dime

    Oh yes you do
    Oh no we don't (x 3)
    Yes! No! Yes! No! (etc.)

    Never call, never write
    Yes we do always try
    Make me cry all the night
    Sorry we made you cry
    Make me mad, Make me sad
    Tell me true, what can I do?

    Way too late can't make up
    All the hate has built up
    Ha ha ha ha aaah

    Alright, we all hate you
    We hate you a lot
    We hate all your family
    We hate your dog Spot

    Even Spot?
    Yes!

    (OTOH: Alice's schmaltzy "Next, Next" in Mae West's 1978 "Sextette" -- penned by Van "Do The Hustle!" McCoy -- is the sort of torch song that makes you wish they'd torched the whole movie set!)

    Of that I was not aware! Gosh!

      - mnw


    It's possible I suppose, as Groucho and Alice supposedly were friends.  It's also documented (by Alice) that John Lennon loved "Elected." 

    Yeah, the lyrics definitely could be Marxian, but the point is really brought home if one were to hear the tone of the song, especially the call and response nature of it.

    [youtube=425,350]AhVBOMbc4NI[/youtube]

    I LOVE this song!

    Offline Smaug

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    Re: Who's More PUNK - Stooges or Marx Bros?
    « Reply #8 on: October 17, 2009, 09:13:13 PM »
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  • Alice put Groucho on his greatest hits album cover,here is a pic

    http://www.odinartcollectables.com/images/aliceCoopersGreatestHits.jpg

    also looks like Peter Lorre and Jean Harlow (maybe, let me know if I'm wrong) are on there.

    This is from wikipedia (take it or leave it)---"Non-musician fans of Cooper's have included Groucho Marx and Mae West, who both saw the early shows as a form of vaudeville revue, and artist Salvador Dalí, who on attending a show in 1973 described it as being surreal, and made a hologram entitled First Cylindric Chromo-Hologram Portrait of Alice Cooper's Brain."
    He did put on a hell of a show.

    Offline FineBari3

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    Re: Who's More PUNK - Stooges or Marx Bros?
    « Reply #9 on: October 18, 2009, 09:09:56 AM »
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  • Alice put Groucho on his greatest hits album cover,here is a pic

    http://www.odinartcollectables.com/images/aliceCoopersGreatestHits.jpg

    also looks like Peter Lorre and Jean Harlow (maybe, let me know if I'm wrong) are on there.

    This is from wikipedia (take it or leave it)---"Non-musician fans of Cooper's have included Groucho Marx and Mae West, who both saw the early shows as a form of vaudeville revue, and artist Salvador Dalí, who on attending a show in 1973 described it as being surreal, and made a hologram entitled First Cylindric Chromo-Hologram Portrait of Alice Cooper's Brain."
    He did put on a hell of a show.

    Agreed. Alice's show that I saw in the early 90's was one of the best that I have seen. A great showman!
    Mar-Jean Zamperini
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    Offline Rich Finegan

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    Re: Who's More PUNK - Stooges or Marx Bros?
    « Reply #10 on: October 20, 2009, 01:23:51 AM »
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  • Alice Cooper must be a fan of old movies. One of his very best songs (well one of my favorites anyway) is "The Ballad of Dwight Fry" on the "Love it to Death" album (1971).

    And on the "School's Out" album (1972) he worked some "West Side Story" themes into some of the songs.

    There probably are more examples.

    Offline Rich Finegan

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    Re: Who's More PUNK - Stooges or Marx Bros?
    « Reply #11 on: October 20, 2009, 02:44:50 AM »
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  • Although Queen used Marx Bros. movie titles for only two of their albums, there were Queen bootleg albums that continued the theme. I know of a least one, called "Duck Soup".

    Offline metaldams

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    Re: Who's More PUNK - Stooges or Marx Bros?
    « Reply #12 on: October 20, 2009, 09:43:02 AM »
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  • Alice Cooper must be a fan of old movies. One of his very best songs (well one of my favorites anyway) is "The Ballad of Dwight Fry" on the "Love it to Death" album (1971).

    And on the "School's Out" album (1972) he worked some "West Side Story" themes into some of the songs.

    There probably are more examples.

    He got Vincent Price to do a guest appearance on "The Black Widow" from his WELCOME TO MY NIGHTMARE album.  This is 7 years before Thriller.

    I too think "The Ballad Of Dwight Fry" is one of Alice's best songs.

     

    Offline Smaug

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    Re: Who's More PUNK - Stooges or Marx Bros?
    « Reply #13 on: October 20, 2009, 07:18:40 PM »
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  • [youtube=425,350]gZy5MX_kBto[/youtube]


    Whoa, flashback.....



    « Last Edit: October 21, 2009, 06:58:45 PM by metaldams »

    Offline metaldams

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    Re: Who's More PUNK - Stooges or Marx Bros?
    « Reply #14 on: October 21, 2009, 07:01:21 PM »
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  • [youtube=425,350]gZy5MX_kBto[/youtube]


    Whoa, flashback.....





    Thanks for the link, Smaug.  As big an Alice fan as I am, I've never seen THE NIGHTMARE TV special.  Glad to see it's on youtube, I may have to make it part of my Halloween viewing this year.

    I just saw Vincent Price in THE TINGLER last night on TCM, what a fun film.

    By the way, here the link Smaug originally posted.  i didn't realize the actual footage wouldn't play on this site.


    Offline Smaug

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    Re: Who's More PUNK - Stooges or Marx Bros?
    « Reply #15 on: October 23, 2009, 03:00:32 PM »
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  • We watched it when it was first broadcast(Doobfest). In Detroit (and other cities as well) it was simulcast on a local FM station, so we recorded it on to an 8-track tape. Made a nice recording of the California Jam (ELP, Deep Purple, etc.) the same way.

    Side note, Vincent Price seems to be there every time I turn around lately- just a wierd coincidence I guess....

    Offline metaldams

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    Re: Who's More PUNK - Stooges or Marx Bros?
    « Reply #16 on: October 23, 2009, 05:20:28 PM »
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  • Made a nice recording of the California Jam (ELP, Deep Purple, etc.) the same way.



    That Deep Purple California Jam show (w/ Coverdale and Hughes) is on DVD and I have it.  Great show! I really love that lineup of DP.  They start at sunset and it's dark by show's end.  Blackmore destroys his guitar like a lunatic at the end.

    Offline FineBari3

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    Re: Who's More PUNK - Stooges or Marx Bros?
    « Reply #17 on: October 24, 2009, 09:07:35 AM »
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  • We watched it when it was first broadcast(Doobfest). In Detroit (and other cities as well) it was simulcast on a local FM station, so we recorded it on to an 8-track tape. Made a nice recording of the California Jam (ELP, Deep Purple, etc.) the same way.

    Side note, Vincent Price seems to be there every time I turn around lately- just a wierd coincidence I guess....

    Doobfest?

    I'm all in for that!
    Mar-Jean Zamperini
    "Moe is their leader." -Homer Simpson

    Offline middlenamewayne

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    Re: Who's More PUNK - Stooges or Marx Bros?
    « Reply #18 on: October 27, 2009, 08:26:21 PM »
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  • Doobfest?

    I'm all in for that!

    I'd be all in FROM that!

    PS: "Boopy Doobs" would be a good name for Stooge-endorsed rolling papers w/Betty B.'s picture on them (which I'm sure already are being sold SOMEWHERE!!!

      - mnw

    Offline wingman77

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    Re: Who's More PUNK - Stooges or Marx Bros?
    « Reply #19 on: March 22, 2010, 03:36:52 AM »
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  • Stooges; they're very anti-authoritarian (most of the time)

     


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